Exclusive: The U.S.-led aggressions against Iraq and Libya are two war crimes that keep on costing, with their grim examples of what happens to leaders who get rid of WMDs driving the scary showdown with North Korea, writes Robert Parry.
By Robert Parry
It is a popular meme in the U.S. media to say that North Korean leader Kim Jong Un is “crazy” as he undertakes to develop a nuclear bomb and a missile capacity to deliver it, but he is actually working from a cold logic dictated by the U.S. government’s aggressive wars and lack of integrity.
Indeed, the current North Korea crisis, which could end up killing millions of people, can be viewed as a follow-on disaster to President George W. Bush’s Iraq War and President Barack Obama’s Libyan intervention. Those wars came after the leaders of Iraq and Libya had dismantled their dangerous weapons programs, leaving their countries virtually powerless when the U.S. government chose to invade.
In both cases, the U.S. government also exploited its power over global information to spread lies about the targeted regimes as justification for the invasions — and the world community failed to do anything to block the U.S. aggressions.
And, on a grim personal note, the two leaders, Saddam Hussein and Muammar Gaddafi, were then brutally murdered, Hussein by hanging and Gaddafi by a mob that first sodomized him with a knife.
So, the neoconservatives who promoted the Iraq invasion supposedly to protect the world from Iraq’s alleged WMDs — and the liberal interventionists who pushed the Libya invasion based on false humanitarian claims — may now share in the horrific possibility that millions of people in North Korea, South Korea, Japan and maybe elsewhere could die from real WMDs launched by North Korea and/or by the United States.
Washington foreign policy “experts” who fault President Trump’s erratic and bellicose approach toward this crisis may want to look in the mirror and consider how they contributed to the mess by ignoring the predictable consequences from the Iraq and Libya invasions.
Yes, I know, at the time it was so exciting to celebrate the Bush Doctrine of preemptive wars even over a “one percent” suspicion that a “rogue state” like Iraq might share WMDs with terrorists — or the Clinton Doctrine hailed by Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s acolytes enamored by her application of “smart power” to achieve “regime change” in Libya.
However, as we now know, both wars were built upon lies. Iraq did not possess WMD stockpiles as the Bush administration claimed, and Libya was not engaged in mass murder of civilians in rebellious areas in the eastern part of the country as the Obama administration claimed.
Post-invasion investigations knocked down Bush’s WMD myth in Iraq, and a British parliamentary inquiry concluded that Western governments misrepresented the situation in eastern Libya where Gaddafi forces were targeting armed rebels but not indiscriminately killing civilians.
But those belated fact-finding missions were no comfort to either Saddam Hussein or Muammar Gaddafi, nor to their countries, which have seen mass slaughters resulting from the U.S.-sponsored invasions and today amount to failed states.
There also has been virtually no accountability for the war crimes committed by the Bush and Obama administrations. Bush and Obama both ended up serving two terms as President. None of Bush’s senior advisers were punished – and Hillary Clinton received the 2016 Democratic Party’s nomination for President.
As for the U.S. mainstream media, which behaved as boosters for both invasions, pretty much all of the journalistic war advocates have continued on with their glorious careers. To excuse their unprofessional behavior, some even have pushed revisionist lies, such as the popular but false claim that Saddam Hussein was to blame because he pretended that he did have WMDs – when the truth is that his government submitted a detailed 12,000-page report to the United Nations in December 2002 describing how the WMDs had been destroyed (though that accurate account was widely mocked and ultimately ignored).
The dishonesty that now pervades the U.S. government and the U.S. mainstream media represents another contributing factor to the North Korean crisis. What sensible person anywhere on the planet would trust U.S. assurances? Who would believe what the U.S. government says, except, of course, the U.S. mainstream media?
Remember also that North Korea’s nuclear program had largely been mothballed before George W. Bush delivered his “axis of evil” speech in January 2002, which linked Iran and Iraq – then bitter enemies – with North Korea. After that, North Korea withdrew from earlier agreements on limiting its nuclear development and began serious work on a bomb.
Yet, while North Korea moved toward a form of mutual assured destruction, Iraq and Libya chose a different path.
In Iraq, to head off a threatened U.S.-led invasion, Hussein’s government sought to convince the international community that it had lived up to its commitments regarding the destruction of its WMD arsenal and programs. Besides the detailed declaration, Iraq gave U.N. weapons inspectors wide latitude to search on the ground.
But Bush cut short the inspection efforts in March 2003 and launched his “shock and awe” invasion, which led to the collapse of Hussein’s regime and the dictator’s eventual capture and hanging.
In Libya, Gaddafi also sought to cooperate with international demands regarding WMDs. In late 2003, he announced that his country would eliminate its unconventional weapons programs, including a nascent nuclear project.
Gaddafi also sought to get Libya out from under economic sanctions by taking responsibility for the 1988 bombing of Pan Am 103 over Scotland, although he and his government continued to deny carrying out the terror attack that killed 270 people.
But these efforts to normalize Libya’s relations with the West failed to protect him or his country. In 2011 when Islamic militants staged an uprising around Benghazi, Gaddafi moved to crush it, and Secretary of State Clinton eagerly joined with some European countries in seeking military intervention to destroy Gaddafi’s regime.
The United Nations Security Council approved a plan for the humanitarian protection of civilians in and around Benghazi, but the Obama administration and its European allies exploited that opening to mount a full-scale “regime change” war.
Prominent news personalities, such as MSNBC’s Andrea Mitchell, cheered on the war with the claim that Gaddafi had American “blood on his hands” over the Pan Am 103 case because he had accepted responsibility. The fact that his government continued to deny actual guilt – and the international conviction of Libyan Abdelbaset al-Megrahi was a judicial travesty – was ignored. Almost no one in the West dared question the longtime groupthink of Libyan guilt.
By October 2011, Gaddafi had fled Tripoli and was captured by rebels in Sirte. He was tortured, sodomized with a knife and then executed. Clinton, whose aides felt she should claim credit for Gaddafi’s overthrow as part of a Clinton Doctrine, celebrated his murder with a laugh and a quip, “We came; we saw; he died.”But Gaddafi’s warnings about Islamist terrorists in Benghazi came back to haunt Clinton when on Sept. 11, 2012, militants attacked the U.S. consulate and CIA station there, killing Ambassador Christopher Stevens and three other Americans.
The obsessive Republican investigation into the Benghazi attack failed to demonstrate many of the lurid claims about Clinton’s negligence, but it did surface the fact that she had used a private server for her official State Department emails, which, in turn, led to an FBI investigation which severely damaged her 2016 presidential run.
Meanwhile, back in North Korea, the young dictator Kim Jong Un was taking all this history in. According to numerous sources, he concluded that his and North Korea’s only safeguard would be a viable nuclear deterrent to stave off another U.S.-sponsored “regime change” war — with him meeting a similar fate as was dealt to Hussein and Gaddafi.
Since then, Kim and his advisers have made clear that the surrender of North Korea’s small nuclear arsenal is off the table. They make the understandable point that the United States has shown bad faith in other cases in which leaders have given up their WMDs in compliance with international demands and then saw their countries invaded and faced grisly executions themselves.
Now, the world faces a predicament in which an inexperienced and intemperate President Trump confronts a crisis that his two predecessors helped to create and make worse. Trump has threatened “fire and fury” like the world has never seen, suggesting a nuclear strike on North Korea, which, in turn, has vowed to retaliate.
Millions of people on the Korean peninsula and Japan – and possibly elsewhere – could die in such a conflagration. The world’s economy could be severely shaken, given Japan’s and South Korea’s industrial might and the size of their consumer markets.
If such a horror does come to pass, the U.S. government and the U.S. mainstream media will surely revert to their standard explanation that Kim was simply “crazy” and brought this destruction on himself. Trump’s liberal critics also might attack Trump for bungling the diplomacy.
But the truth is that many of Washington’s elite policymakers – both on the Republican and Democratic sides – will share in the blame. And so too should the U.S. mainstream media.
Investigative reporter Robert Parry broke many of the Iran-Contra stories for The Associated Press and Newsweek in the 1980s. You can buy his latest book, America’s Stolen Narrative, either in print here or as an e-book (from Amazon and barnesandnoble.com).
The most astonishing thing is the way North Korea has created a thermonuclear weapon and a fleet of ICBM’s- on a shoestring.
All we hear about is what a madman Kim Jong Un is, how his country looks like a black hole almost without electricity from a satellite view, and how the people are starving, and with sanctions virtually unable to sell export products, and yet, for what- the cost of a single
F-35 fighter?- they have done all this. An atrocious waste of resources, yes, but compared to the ever-growing, enormous bloated leech that is the U.S. military-industrial-complex, relentlessly impoverishing the middle class, it is a lesson in economics.
Hey Parry… you forgot the “Xi Dioctrine” . China has pledged to intervene if the US attacks NKOR. That’s what Bannon meant when he said there are no viable military options in NKOR.
Mr Parry you need to go further back.
The original regime change and the original NATO attack on a sovereign state on behalf of a US created islamic terrorist organisation was the destruction of Yugoslavia, the illegal attack on Serbia and the islamic terrorist KLA – still running Kosovo.
It is the blueprint for Syria, Iraq and Libya.
Little news was given to the recent clearing of Slobodan Milesovic – declared an innocent man and the Serbs cleared of ethnic cleansing, mass graves and war crimes.
All trumped up and bogus.
Want to cite chapter and verse on that? Otherwise it’s not “doctrine”, it’s just how things work out, given that no country other than the nine listed HAVE tactical nukes…until North Korea… We may well see your “doctrine” broken in the near term.
The wars of aggression initiated by the U.S. could not have happened without a corrupt mainstream media that has definitely moved away from providing news to the American public to acting as an echo chamber for the warlike U.S. administrations which are abjectly subservient to American zealots for Israel. These zealots include Christian fundamentalists and Israeli firsters, fanatically loyal Jews to Israel who support Israeli policies above and ahead of U.S. policy. Many, though not all, of these zany Jewish Americans hold dual citizenship with Israel, and their loyalty is always to Israel.
These words are so horrifically politically incorrect that a majority of readers will reject such hate speech, but truth is truth, and until Americans begin to think for themselves, our country is going to continue down an extremely dangerous path plotted by Israeli loyalists.
Every empire has fallen, and American power willl continue to decline until Americans learn to read and manage to acquire a mainstream media dedicated to reporting the news, accurately and fairly, instead of spewing propaganda for Israel.
Harsh words but written not by an anti-semite but an American dedicated to seeing truth in our newspapers instead of lies.
There are two more crucial points;-
1) N. Korea was lined up for Regime Change.
The propaganda started in 1992 with the story that there was a famine in N.Korea.
The attack was launched in 2010 as a “Humanitarian Intervention” in the belief that China would not oppose it. Then came the hysterical politburo meeting in Harbin.
US policy is to disarm nations with Deterrent weapons, as said this would surprise the American public, then attack them.
An Iranian guy I know who was close to the top government before the revolution said to me “If we weren’t in Iraq and Afghanistan the Russians or Chinese would be there.
This is true and Americans like myself are naive, we can be antiwar and anti imperialism and still maintain this lifestyle of ours, plus wide open low wage borders.
Gime a break.
I grew up.
This is what I posted over at Antiwar.com related to Justin Raimondo suggesting that if the US pulled out of the Iran Deal that Iran would pursue a nuclear weapons program based on the Libya and Iraq argument…
Nukes are a credible deterrent only if 1) you have the means to deliver them, and 2) you can get enough of them to be a credible threat BEFORE your enemies can attack you in conventional war to prevent you.
Iran knows full well that it can never achieve both aims before being attacked by Israel and the US – so they don’t try and won’t try. They’re too far behind Israel, let alone the US.
North Korea is bringing about a war on itself precisely because it is trying because Kim doesn’t understand that the Libya and Iraq models are flawed because deterrence only works if you can get enough nukes BEFORE someone attacks you.
The only reason North Korea has gotten this far is because their massive conventional forces has served as a deterrent. Now that deterrence is eroding precisely because of an effort to get nukes.
Because 10-30 nukes – the maximum NK has, if that – and no demonstrated ability to deliver them – there is no proof the existing NK missiles can deliver them as far as the West Coast (yet) let alone the rest of the US – is not enough deterrent to a country like the US. And all it’s done is make Japan and South Korea now want to get their own nukes – which THEY can only do without being attacked by China and North Korea because they are protected by the United States.
Getting nukes only worked for the US, Russia, China, England, France, Germany, India and Pakistan – and Israel – because those countries were never under threat of attack due to massive conventional forces OR the support of the US which already had nukes in sufficient quantity.
People need to stop talking about the Libya model and more about the Iraq model. Saddam was attacked under the excuse (not the reality) that he was seeking nukes. Iran understands that. North Korea doesn’t.
I’n sorry US doctrine states you don’t attack a country with tactical nuclear weapons.
were getting to relive another mistake,trump. im a long time resident in north dakota,weather,red,republican blood red. im common working class, with my education in,reading. reading journalism and history,that is honest in opinion,and facts, I can shuck and jive with the best, i like a good banter with like minded workers,and make my opinion known. Im not well recieved when i buck their system.I dont throw bombs,i rattle off my knowlege and readings from sources obvioulsly,not their sources,and make a point,and often,not to their likeing.Im living with people who could care less about our countries survival,as long as their views are met. They obviously are choking on that silver spoon.Though most are,working class,30 years of flat wages,barely making it,debts to the banks,jobs here with no laws to protect them from abuse,corprate dominance that they feel safe with.at 62, raised in n.j. n.y.c metro area,lived the 70s southern calif,my expansion of the mind is obvoius,as i see a closed society trying to
make the world like them. god help em… (im a non believer) im blown away by their candor about how tough it is,while they vote themselves down a shit hole of no return. but,those damn job stealing mexicans can all go to hell, that black sob better not come here for welfare(we have none) and hillary is a traitor. anyway,from that, we got trump and his minions from the likes of closed minds and republican gerrymandering. if the right side of the isle is so intent on winning at the cost of our citizens being made economic slaves to a system rigged to beifit the rich, then its a new form of treason. the selling out of democracy and education,to become the next foxconn of the world. were at a new cross road,im getting organisations mail. lots of sites relying on donations,but most have the same basic principles.maybe they really need a job , and more time mentoring someone who needs it the most. we can all sit and socialize on online,but the best is to meet,and discuss,because those death bed buddies i asociate with,who never look at those sites. and few are,willing to change,unless, they can find new friends,and carry on like a few drunks who started the last war… maybe some chiling citizenship to our own would well be in order.best wishes,from a blue target in a red state..
if i would be the head of state in North Korea , i would do exactly what they are doing , the examples of Libya Irack which was successful for the west , the failed examples of Syria would comfort my will to be in a possible retaliatory position to protect my country from U S aggression ……now unfortunately many countries are going to arm them selves with a nuclear Arsenal starting with Japan and South Korea, as the U S is now powerless to stop North Korea in fear of atomic retaliation … even possible on is own soil
interesting article at link below:
North Korea nuclear crisis: Putin warns of planetary catastrophe
As Kim Jong-un reportedly prepares further missile launch, Russian president says further sanctions would be ‘useless’
Justin McCurry in Tokyo and Tom Phillips in Beijing
Tuesday 5 September 2017 19.46 BST
Everyone can see the simple truth, except those who choose not to see it because it interferes with their not so hidden plans to dominate the world.
IMHO all Kim Jong Un really wants is a reasonable guarantee of security for himself and his country. Why the heck don’t we give it to him, and enlist the Chinese and Russians as co-guarantors?
But Robert Parry doesn’t even mention this possibility, and maybe it really is too late.
Why not give NK the peace they want? Because we (USA) might lose our status as world bully and would be ruler of Earth.
North Korea has not forgotten the Amerikastani genocide of its population from 1949-53 when 20% of the population was massacred, the survivors driven underground, and Pyongyang destroyed so totally that only two buildings were left. North Korea has no desire to see that happen again. Therefore while it will keep a nuclear deterrent, it will remain a deterrent.
South Korea also does not want war because unlike its Amerikastani overlords, it is right on the border and it will suffer the consequences in case of a war, even a non nuclear one.
Neither of the Koreas, with excellent reason, do anything else but loathe Japan, which also can’t be pleased at the idea of being hit by a nuclear bomb or two.
So who’s left that might want war? Who is it that thinks it’s got a right to rule the planet, is the only country in the world to use nuclear weapons, and has threatened their use many times since? Who is it that’s engaged in multiple wars of choice around the globe right now?
USA! USA! USA! THAT’S WHO.
Hillary sez: Blame Bernie for all the turmoil in the world that Trump just exacerbates!
Cee En En Headline: New Clinton book blasts Sanders for ‘lasting damage’ in 2016 race
“Hillary Clinton casts Bernie Sanders as an unrealistic over-promiser in her new book, according to excerpts posted by a group of Clinton supporters.
She said that his attacks against her during the primary caused ‘lasting damage’ and paved the way for (Donald) Trump’s ‘Crooked Hillary’ campaign.’ ”
“He didn’t get into the race to make sure a Democrat won the White House, he got in to disrupt the Democratic Party.”
And his supporters, whom she slurs as “Bernie Bros,” were basically misogynists–” ‘more than a little sexist,’ she wrote.”
Just think, if we only knew then what we know now, none of this unpleasantness in the world would have ever happened. Putin, Xi, Assad, Rouhani and Kim would all know their place, groveling before the Queen of Chaos.
“Blame Bernie: Hilary in 2020!”
–Moderation yet again! Okay, I see, it is personal.–
Yesterday I was talking to a relative about Trump, and said that if the Power Elites like what he has been doing, they’ll arrange for Hiilary to run against him again in 2020. In my opinion she is the only person in the US he could beat.
How fascism begins:
Very well written article. THANK YOU Mr. Parry. Does anyone dare ask where N.Korea got nuclear technology? Try the same Pakistani scientist that the USA gave it to. Does anyone dare ask where N.Korea got long range missiles? I’m guessing our “friends” in Ukraine. Gotta keep the war machine well fed. Like the ONE TRILLION dollars Mr. Nobel Peace Prize, Obama authorized for new nuclear weapons. Free college tuition? HAHAHAHAHA.
WAKE UP AMERICA.
Thank you for this I repeat over and over the only countries the U.S. leaves alone are those with WMD,,,,something I never hear i the news
Article of interest at link below:
North Korea: “Annihilation”, “Massive Military Response” or Economic Warfare?
Washington Contemplates a Total Freeze on Trade with North Korea, as well as Possible Sanctions Directed against China
By Prof Michel Chossudovsky
Global Research, September 04, 2017
Eva Bartlett, an independent writer and rights activist with extensive experience in Syria and in the Gaza Strip, visited the DPRK (North Korea) from August 24 to 31, 2017. She writes:
“Please bear in mind that this country is among the most vilified on earth–along with Syria and formerly (now-destroyed) Libya, to name a few. Western media does not speak of North Korea’s people, nor of the amazing infrastructure, free housing and medical care, impressive agriculture and green energy, and the many things the people of the DPRK have done so well which I’ll elaborate on over the coming days.
“Pyongyang, and much of North Korea, was leveled in the 50s by US bombings, with reportedly just one or two low-level buildings standing. After destroying and murdering in DPRK, America slapped sanctions on the country. How the people have continued, and made huge advances, is worthy of respect. The absurdly cartoonish ‘news’ one hears in western media about North Korea is meant to detract from America’s crimes against the Korean people, and to garner support for yet another American-led slaughter of innocent people.
“One high school student commented something to the effect: ‘Why doesn’t anyone put sanctions on America?’ Too true.”
Photos From a Week in the DPRK
By Eva Bartlett
Thank you so much for this post. The same lies were told about Cuba and Libya, which were actually advanced socialist countries. The American people have been consistently lied to by our government and the media throughout our history.
The most interesting to me from this excellent website are the similarities between Gaddafi’s Libya and North Korea – if one was not involved in politics (trying to change the leadership of the country), one could live a truly comfortable life without constant fear of something: Global Warming, Russia, terrorism and so on and so on. The best definition of freedom is – living without fear.
Kiza, you reacted with more of an emotional outburst to my most recent post, I addressed to mike k. You did not carefully? review the substance of those historical precedence(s) I posted herein, particularly about my rather negative reaction to the NEOCON stance…Please! devote your responses to my rather brief, list of historical FACTS I thought relevant to bring into this general discussion..
well done Eva !
“the Trump administration is renewing its efforts to enlist China to do its dirty work: bankrupt Pyongyang. A form of forced economic encirclement is proposed. The South Korean President Moon Jae-in has also suggested cutting off North Korea’s access to crude oil and foreign currency sources.
“Beijing is hardly thrilled to shrink trade with a state that actually grew last year. ‘A temporary or partial ban is possible,’ suggested Shi Yinhong, an adviser to the Chinese cabinet, ‘but the Chinese government will definitely refuse to cut off oil exports completely or permanently to North Korea.’
“The method of forcibly starving a country of its oil and other necessaries has a good precedent for encouraging, rather than discouraging war. The United States was very much in the position of provoking conflict when it came to dealing with Japan in 1941.”
Beggars for War: The U.S., North Korea and Bankruptcy
By Binoy Kampmark
While the world is fixated on North Korea there is a Holocaust happening in Yemen: Precipitated by “our great leaders,” a war crime of massive proportions is being enacted See link below:
September 2, 2017
The Holocaust in Yemen
There is a Holocaust in Yemen, does anyone care?
Children are being slaughtered by bombs from the air
Their parents are being killed and their homes destroyed
Are world “leaders” guilty and of sympathy devoid?
Cholera is raging and disease is rampant
Help from humanity is notably absent
Instead “our leaders” supply the weapons of death
Today’s war criminals are of decency bereft
These blood soaked villains in luxury reside
And the helpless people of Yemen have nowhere to hide
Their homes are razed and reduced to rubble
Their hospitals are bombed which creates more trouble
They have nowhere to run and nowhere to go
As bombs from the sky rain down below
Victims of violence, their country is being destroyed
Everything is gone, that they once enjoyed
Head chopping war criminals and their western allies
Are responsible for the bloodshed and thousands that die
They are partners in war crimes, to which we must say, “Amen”
They are all responsible for the Holocaust in Yemen
“The Saudi-led coalition and its Western patrons are among the chief authors of nightmarish conditions that threaten the lives of millions of innocent civilians.”
Daniel Larson, July 20, 2017. The American Conservative….
[Much more info at link below]
Thanks Stephen. Another deadly albatross around us US citizen’s necks. Our evil karma is truly IMMENSE.
Even worse, the same crew of neocons is calling for the same sort of regime change in North Korea. It does not require any imagination by the North, just reading the WSJ.
Any idea that the neocons have any sort of intelligent plans or reasoned approaches, should be discarded. The total failures resulting from their previous regime change efforts do not register in their deluded minds at all. These are not folks who learn from their mistakes.
Clinton and Obama are neoCons… I thought they were liberal Democrats… or are they all the same product sold under different brand names.
The USA has a major collective mental health problem these days.
You are right Bill to point out the collective nature of our insanity. A large portion of Americans elected this fascist incompetent to the Presidency. The rest of us are passively going along with the lies the media spoon feed us. Looking for a sane person in this Orwellian mess is like Diogenes going through the streets of ancient Athens with a lighted lantern in broad daylight seeking to find an honest man. Blaming someone else for everything just won’t cut it – we have met the enemy, and guess who it is? Does it take a cartoon possum to wake us up?
Mike k, another unproductive commentary that does not address specific political/military issue(s), options, or offer of some solution(s) to the crisis at hand-North Korea.
Sorry, I reacted to your (not) brilliant idea of a military attack on North Korea. I thought by this time those commenting here would understand that any military strike against North Korea at this time would cause a reaction from them that would deeply damage South Korea, and possibly Japan as well. This is the only consideration that has restrained our military from conducting such a first strike “surgical” or not.
Again, I apologize for my flip response to your idea. I will try to be more polite in future.
The solution to the problems we have with North Korea is to get the hell out of both Koreas, and mind our own business for a change, instead of trying to dominate the world and enslave it’s population. North Korea has repeatedly suggested we sit down with them and workout a settlement of our issues. We have just as consistently refused to do so. The world bully does not seek compromises. The US simply needs to give peace a chance instead of indulging in threats and trying to starve and intimidate our “enemies”. Maybe they would not be seen as enemies if we tried negotiating with them?
Mike k, the U.S. did try the peaceful route. Back in August 2000 terms of a possible agreement would have taken hold, if not for the likes of Bush Jr.s and his NeoCon cliques’ interference (early in 2001). Since then, the world did indeed, look the other way when, in reaction to many diplomatic failures, Un decided that maintaining battlefield nukes were necessary to preserve North Korean sovereignty. At present, he’s making every effort to project this nuclear force (estimated at ten to perhaps fifty) A-bombs beyond what is essential for countering the South’s offensive capabilities. ASIDE: In my view, this moment in history was mirrored during the rise of Hitler. Millions of German’s gathered like sardines in a can, to hear his fanatical ravings, and yet not one hand in this sea of people had a gun and a bullet with Herr Hitler’s name on it. Thus, twenty seven million Russians had to pay the full price. That price did not stop on the battlefield, because after 1945, all these soldiers who died had no offspring, a demographic condition the Russians have yet to recover from, ditto for the likes of Pol Pot and those two million human skulls of Khmer Rouge, ditto for the holocaust and six million Jews, again ditto for the CCCP’s “butcher” Stalin who killed millions of his own people (as if WW II wasn’t enough) ..there are at least a dozen equivalent and recent historical examples I can cite here, but no. My point is this, there comes a time when all hope in negotiation is over. If the Russians have forgotten their history, so be it, if the Chinese want to dither about and not summon up the dark powers within their culture to eliminate a fat, useless, sat trap of a tyrant, right on their border, than so be it. The reason, may I remind the world at large, that the USA is the default policeman, is mainly due to many a country’s option not to carry all the financial burdens of a truly self sufficient defense budget that guaranty’s sovereign cultures and their people(s). That said, behold the American Eagle, six thousand military installations at home and nine hundred or so abroad. I need to remind the offices of the United Nations, Federal Reserve Bank board members and associated multinational corporations along with their sycophant banksters, that, since 1945, the USA remained utterly and totally committed to PICK UP THE PIECES AND THE MILITARY WEIGHT for everyone else, everywhere. Meanwhile, the second, and third world members, plus the four dragons all responded to our Post WW II policing vulnerabilities by manufacturing autos instead of tanks, among many other, non-competitive, finished products. Thus, ever so gradually, crushing the USA’s pliability to return to a peacetime manufacturing status. Well, you all gave us the keys, so to speak, so our new POTUS is telling you, Un has got to go. And Go he will, or there will be nothing left for anyone to gloat over, anywhere…just how important is that little runt to all of you? Further, if this diatribe is unbearable, then the only option remaining is a truly global and financial debt “jubilee” declared by all nations to reset the new global order button- Now I say firmly, I ask a devastatingly important question, in light of the fact that we’re on the brink of WW III, what chance is there for a jubilee or for world peace?
Mike k, why do not you ignore the ravings of this crapster. He is just one of those pests regurgitating the long discredited Ziocon US regime propaganda. His nick also says everything one needs to know about him. You and I did not always see eye-to-eye, but I would subscribe to your North Korea solution without hesitation.
As I typed above – the US has such a unblemished track record of lying in absolutely every agreement it made or signed that the only relevant guarantees for peace in the area can come from China and Russia. Both China and Russia would be much, much happier if Kim Jong-un were to tone down his military boastfulness, mainly because it is exposing the impotence of US to protect its investments (much US capital invested in South Korea and Japan would be lost, who cares about millions dead). Simply put, exposing the impotence of US, a declining hegemon, to the whole World to see is not a good approach yet, because the dumb bully/maniac could lash out and make a big mess of the whole region.
Elmer, mike K offers excellent philosophical perspective. not always an answer sought by a particular commenter. Let us leave off the personal commentary.
Your “all hope of negotiation is over” comment below is plainly false, as there is no necessity for the US to do anything in Korea. You are exaggerating risks posed by an obviously purely defensive NK deterrent. Have you no awareness of the history of Korea? Do you think that the fear and hatred caused by US genocides is to be countered by more bombing, rather than aid, patience, and diplomacy?
Also plainly false is your notion that “the USA is the default policeman” when we have seen that nonsense fail without exception for seventy years due to the complete failure of the US to understand or care about the rest of the world. Ten million innocents killed for zero successes, a policy of warmongering which grew from no humanitarian policy or achievable goals whatsoever.
You are ignoring human needs and history and making absurd threats, not a debate position.
Anon, you’ll be singing a different tune should Un convince himself that the Japanese and Americans plan to sink his fishing fleets or have sunk one of his submarines-deliberately. . He’ll send up a rocket and set off a small nuke far above Tokyo or Guam.to accomplish EMP damage..or he may chose to do worse. The North and South Koreans had sixty years to work out a reunification-never happened-we just can’t wait any longer, both Japan’s and South Koreans economies (not to mention ours as well) are just too weak to take such a hit (s).
There are ample reason(s) to assume that China (the CCP or is it Xi himself?) is playing the “North Korea card” during back room negotiations with the west and they are playing that card to the hilt. No doubt, to win concessions from it’s neighbors for that utterly unjustifiable, enormous ocean grab policy China has adopted since the early 1990’s. Let’s review a bit of history here; since the early 1900’s humanity has witnessed may high profile political assassinations (heads of state and other national leaders). There were at least eight presidents murdered, during a ten year period prior to WW I, and many more were to follow all across the world; Huey Long, JFK. RFK , Ngo Dinh Diem and his brother Nhu, MLK, Malcolm X, Anwar Sadat.Yasser Arafat,….Et Al. Add too, the endless list of now forgotten, assassinated politicians, of socialist or communist persuasion during the post WW II, CIA sponsored, European Gladio program(s). For example; Aldo Moro and Alfred Herrhausen. Yet we are all expected to believe that somehow, Xi cannot whistle up China’s notorious triad and their closely associated tong families and “persuade” them to remove a far more virulent danger to all of humanity: a fratricidal, glutton, power hungry control freak and decadent tyrant. The powers that be found it so easy to remove all the fine and honorable men I have just mentioned but chose to spare this degenerate? Lastly, I know our military doesn’t like to reveal or apply exotic weaponry to the battlefield that may impact on future sales of other high tech weapons, but they may wish to “show their hand now” and use Tungsten missiles shot from near space, launched at seven miles per second down towards military and not civilian targets in North Korea. No explosives and no use of mini-nukes. Let the cards fall where they may, this is NOT entirely our fault!
Thank God there is not a nut case like you in charge of our military. ……Wait a minute – there is!
Mike K-please avoid personal attacks aimed at commentators and focus your attention on the substance of various suggestions or ideas proposed. It’s important to remain as dispassionate as possible when responding to comments. This is the path to truth and this is the way we bring out realistic solutions to problems and crises that confront us all.
Agreed. Please accept my apology. I still disagree with your plan to attack North Korea, but I did not express that in a good way.
Elmer, you do not show how an attack avoids retaliation attacks, the destruction of SK, etc, etc. Nor what is achieved: it cannot eliminate the NK nuclear deterrent, but only rejuvenate their resolve. Why not let them have their deterrent and show them that we do not need to attack them?
Very well written. The problem is that most Americans can’t see further than the end of their street. The Stars and Stripes would be out as soon as war was declared. I would imagine that this one will be initiated by a ‘provocation’. All it would take is for someone to lob a shell across the border from either side. There aren’t enough sensible people in leadership positions to say stop.
Zachary, have you considered that a blockade of of the type you suggest would almost certainly place the U.S. in breach of its obligations under customary international law not to use force against another State, not to intervene in its affairs, not to violate its sovereignty, and not to interrupt peaceful maritime commerce? See Nicaragua v. U.S. (1986), ICJ 1, http://www.icj-cij.org/en/case/70 (U.S. blockade and mining of Nicaragua’s harbors breached those obligations). What you are advocating in my opinion is a war of aggression.
Also consider how you would feel if the roles were reversed, with North Korea being the hegemon with thousands of nuclear weapons plus a global military force that refused to negotiate and the U.S. with its first nukes just coming online? Would you want North Korea to blockade the U.S.?
Paul, my main aim to avoid a full-scale attack on North Korea. The legality of a blockade is probably “iffy”, but I’d say such an operation is less dastardly than sending in the B-2s, the B-1s, and the rest of the Air Force. Less dangerous too, for there is no obvious threat to China with this action.
I’ve already conceded that the US has a great deal of responsibility for the current mess, so your turning the situation around is fair enough. What I believe is different concerns my belief that North Korea is likely to become a retailer of the WMDs. Consider how much outside “expertise” they’ve already purchased or otherwise acquired from other countries. Rockets from Ukraine, reportedly bio-weapon technology from China and Russia, and nuclear assistance from the likes of Pakistan, Iran, and any unemployed or retired Russian nuclear workers. Everybody can read the lessons Mr. Parry spoke of for Iraq and Libya, they’ve been smashed and North Korea is untouched. WE WANT NUKES TOO! North Korea is a poor country, and this would be a great way to make money.
The US used a naval blockade during the Cuban Missile Crisis. I’ll concede that the US of A was mostly responsible for those missiles being sent to Cuba, but the fact that they were so close that we had essentially zero reaction time meant that they had to go.
Wars of aggression come in all sizes, and I’m maintaining a blockade is the XXS size. For what it’s worth, here is a writeup of the legality of Kennedy’s blockade.
Zach can sometimes write good stuff, but I always considered him a bit of Clintonite CN troll in hiding.
How about we blockade your house and kill anyone who delivers anything but food and medicine to it (of course, we decide what is food and medicine)?
Zach is a living proof of how warped and sick US truly is! Hard to find a sane individual! A horribly declining country full of walking brain-dead.
Just as you supplied a link to how the blockade of Cuba was legal, next time please kindly supply us with a link to the Yoo Torture Memo, which establishes that torture of people but only when done by the exceptional US is also legal. Or just read my comment about the legality of the “detective” Jeff Payne above.
A blockade is an act of war.
In my opinion this was the key part of the essay. Nobody with two working brain cells trusts anything put out by either “the U.S. government and the U.S. mainstream media.”
The North Korean thing has been thoroughly mismanaged for decades, and the bill for this is coming due. Mr. Parry did a fine job painting the background of the current mess, but if he said anything about a solution I missed that part.
In 1901 Lenin published a little pamphlet titled What is to be Done?, and I’m taking that as my theme. Unlike most others here, I believe North Korea’s present situation is a problem which must be addressed. Hardly anyone is speaking of the non-nuclear WMDs this country possesses. An artillery barrage of Seoul with high explosives is manageable. If the big NK cannon are loaded with binary nerve gas shells, the death toll will mount to enormous levels. Perhaps the US would be inclined to ignore that, for the deaths of others hasn’t bothered us much in the past. But North Korea also has a stock of bio-weapons. Release of these would move the megadeaths to the US and other nations. In my quite uninformed opinion the existence of the North Korean Germs is the main reason North Korea hasn’t already been put under attack.
So we come back to that title I mentioned – What is to be Done? For discussion purposes I’d propose a naval blockade of North Korea. Any ships attempting to enter would be confiscated or sunk unless they were carrying previously inspected food or medicine cargoes. Those ships leaving would also be inspected, and if they were not empty they’d be confiscated. All unidentified submarines and other NK naval vessels would be sunk. Period.
This would leave the borders with China and Russia as the only ways in and out. The problem would be thus dumped into their laps as for what further progress North Korea was allowed to make with its weapons programs. A final resolution for future US meddling might involve security pacts with both Russian and China. As in, “an attack on NK is an attack on us.”
SK is a muscular economic and military power. Japan is third greatest economic power in the World. It’s ridiculous to think our 30-something thousand troops could defend SK (or Japan for that matter). 30,000 would be what, a few hours worth of casualties if even just a conventional war broke out? We really should just pack up and sail away, like we did from that big naval base in the Philippines, after that volcano in the eighties. If ANYONE can take care of their own defense needs, SK and Japan can. Wish them well and sail on home. it is extremely likely NK is just reacting defensively, NOT hell-bent on conquest. China’s OBOR policy has obsoleted geopolitical conflict, and the days of gunboats and flags are definitely over. This is better-recognized in the Asian-Pacific World than anywhere else. They’ll come to an amicable agreement. We don’t even have to be a partner to it, as we’re clear on the other side of the Pacific, hopefully returning to mind our own business, which is General Welfare, Justice, and DEFENSE (NOT Imperial wars of conquest for some mysterious global Oligarchy) as the Preamble stipulates.
“This is reason enough for the American people to denounce this administration immediately, absolutely, and in no uncertain terms.”
Nothing could be more insane than stating that the leader of North Korea is ‘begging for war.’
Who comes up with these assertions?
According to Wiki the person in question graduated from Clemson University with a bachelor’s degree in accounting. Her non-government experience consisted of keeping the books in her mother’s dress shop. Trump really has a keen eye for picking UN representatives, doesn’t he?
Like with the like.
The US diplomacy has beento threaten with big and bigger stick, and that failing to club em to death, since beforeTeddy walked up Cubas San Juan Ridge.
We have become so despotic when it comes to other nations that we no longer fear any nations retalitory actions if they object.
We assassinate or overthrow even democraticly elected nations rulers and no matter how corrupt andvdespotic a ruler we then install as long as he kisses our financial ass we support them.
It matters not thst since mid 60’s ee have caused the deaths of 20 millions plus, the vast majority being non combattant citizens.
Just as long as the military and power brokers supply. Enough expendable incomes to a quite large portion of public there is no major concern of foreign dead.
While we may bitch piss and moan, those few of us who care and understand just how brutish our leadership is, that comfortable class will stifle any and all dissent that may disturb their comfort zones.
So even if @0-30 millions of dead Koreans may result from our exaulted power players actions, just as long as we feel no pain…….. wave your f’n flags and kiss militarys ass.
Thank you, Robert. Today, Trump’s (silly? corrupt? who knows) person at the U.N. said North Korea (it’s leader)
“…is begging for war.”
This is reason enough for the American people to denounce this administration immediately, absolutely, and in no uncertain terms.
“Later in the meeting, China’s Ambassador to the U.N., Liu Jieyi, pushed for “practical measures” to solve the North Korean nuclear issue, including dialogue.
“The situation on the peninsula is deteriorating constantly as we speak, falling into a vicious circle. The peninsula issue must be resolved peacefully. China will never allow chaos and war on the peninsula,” he said.”
I thought this might interest you Ellen. I also find Lou Jieyi’s comment, ‘China will never allow chaos and war on the peninsula’ pretty intimidating. Joe
Peace in serious jeopardy; no military solution to Korean peninsula crisis – Russia’s UN envoy
Published time: 4 Sep, 2017 14:45Edited time: 4 Sep, 2017 16:39
Is this our final destination?
May 22, 2016
Marching To Doomsday
“I have made the most wonderful discovery, I have discovered men will risk their lives, even die, for ribbons” -Napoleon Bonaparte
Marching towards Doomsday in bemedaled uniforms
Are they the NATO-rious war mongers that should be scorned?
Instead they parade and feed off peoples taxes
Bringing death and destruction to many countries masses
Many people follow and obey the dictators of war
Helping them to facilitate endless blood and gore
Hell on earth rains down from the starry heavens
Napoleon says: “men will… even die, for ribbons”
War and more war is their crazy reason for being
Are maniacs of militarism, what we are seeing?
War criminals and political gangs, that are a curse on the world
Evil personified with their war marketing banners unfurled
Maniacal “leaders” of mayhem, who meet in luxury surroundings
Proud of their actions to set countries burning
Creators of refugees and endless bloody wars
They are the war gangsters that should be abhorred
Instead they are praised by politicians “in charge”
These scurrilous “humans” presently at large
Will nobody arrest them, and put them on trial?
These perverts for war are really hostile and vile
If they are not restrained and put in chains
These caricatures of “humanity” will bring the end game
Planners and plotters of killing, and of murder
Organizers of evil tearing the earth asunder
Invaders of countries that never invaded them
These are the war criminals; are they totally insane?
Could the final acts of these madmen be coming our way?
Will nuclear war be the end of, The March to Doomsday?…
more info at link below]
Great poem Stephen. The truth unvarnished.
Kim Jong Un learned that two-term President George W. Bush overthrew Saddam Hussein as soon as Saddam gave up his weapons of mass destruction. He also learned that two-term President Barack Obama overthrew Muammar Gaddafi as soon as Muammar gave up his weapons of mass destruction. The lesson would appear to be that, if you want two terms, you’d better overthrow somebody’s regime.
But, seriously, it should be painfully obvious that The President has been sequestered and neutralized by the MIC. Mattis, Kelly and McMaster may enjoy talking big talk, but they know the strategic reality better than anybody. And, they were highly incensed when Steve Bannon summed up the truth in one sentence: “Until somebody solves the part of the equation that shows me that ten million people in Seoul don’t die in the first 30 minutes from conventional weapons, I don’t know what you’re talking about, there’s no military solution here, they got us.” Kim has 21,500 artillery pieces aimed at Seoul, most of them revetted into mountainside tunnels where they are immune to air attack.
I’m sticking to my assessment: No war with North Korea. That doesn’t mean no war. It just means no war with North Korea. Hey, I could be wrong. If I am, the Imperial Project almost certainly ends abruptly. I’m betting this is all posturing. After losing Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Somalia, Ukraine and now Yemen, does anybody really think the Neocons can afford to lose to Lil’ Kim?
Yes, the NK chest-beating certainly fits as mere bellicose distraction from the Syria defeat, with a little weapons salesmanship and excuses for China trade restrictions.
An excellent summary, although one might quibble that on a number of issues, it is too understated and kind, with regard to the US guilt in both Iraq and Korea.
The Iraqi 12000-page report, for example, was no only “mocked and ignored”, but was also absconded with, by the US, who refused to release it to other member nations or to the UN to whom it was addressed.
With regard to the DPRK, it bears saying, that they had not only mothballed their graphite moderated reactors and placed their stocks of plutonium under UN supervision, but they had done so under a franmework agreement in which the US also had obligations. While DPRK had met all of its obligations under that agreement, eight years later, the US had met none of its obligations. Among those commitments that the US did not meet, were a non-aggression treaty, facilitation of replacement of the mothballed reactors, with two light water reactors, and a supply of oil to replace the mothballed capacity until such time as it was replaced. Rather than meet these obligations, the Shrub’s administration sent an envoy to North Korea, who returned with claims to have received reports of a clandestine uranium enrichment program. Such a program being many-fold more difficult, costly, and difficult to hide, than simple refinement of plutonium from spent fuel, the claim was patently ridiculous, in relation to a small country that had voluntarily placed its plutonium reserves under UN supervision. Nonetheless, the Shrub used that excuse, not only to brand the DPRK part of an axis of evil, but also to threaten further aggression, and to cut off supplies of the committed oil, at the start of a hard winter. It was under these conditions that the DPRK felt justified to restart its reactors, expell the inspectors, and withdraw from the NPT.
Thanks very much for this concise summary of the Clinton to Shrub II US lies. It reminded me of the prequel of the Reagan and Shrub I to Clinton lies (not one inch eastwards) to SU/Russia. As Clinton promised (and signed) lies to NK, so Reagan promised lies to SU. But President Swamp looks so rotten and boorish that no-one would believe his lies even if he was willing to sign them. This is what US has come down to – zero cred. Thus, even if Swamp signed another Clinton-like agreement with NK, he would not be believed unless China and Russia were the direct guarantors of NK security.
Yes,it is definitely a no-rules game of nuclear chicken by a dying out hegemon. Here is a nice Saker re. invasion of the Russian consulate in SF:
For a while already the Russian diplomats have been openly saying that their American counterparts are ?????????????????? or “non-agreement capable”. This all began under Obama, when Kerry flew to meet with Lavrov and declared ‘A’, then flew back to Washington, DC and declared ‘B’. Then there were the cases in Syria when the US agreed to a deal only to break that very same deal in less than 24 hours. That’s when the Russians openly began to say that their US colleagues are rank amateurs who lack even the basic professionalism to get anything done.
Now the US has slipped even lower: the Russians speak of US “hellish buffoonery” and “stupid thuggery”.
For the normally hyper-diplomatic Russians, this kind of language is absolutely unheard of, this has never ever happened before. You could say that the Russians are naive, but they believe that their diplomats should always be, well, diplomatic, and that public expressions of disgust is just not something a diplomat does. Even more telling is rather than call the Americans “evil” or “devious”, they openly express their total contempt for them, calling them stupid, incompetent, uneducated and their actions unlawful (read Maria Zakharova’s statement to that effect on Facebook).
(Sorry about the Russian Cyrillic letters being converted into ????…)
Here is a Saker’s conclusion:
So let me explain what is happening here how the Russians interpreted the latest US thuggery concerning the Russian Consulate in San Francisco and the Russian diplomatic annexes in Washington and New York….
“We beat them is Syria, we are beat them in the Ukraine, they lost Afghanistan, they lost Iraq, their Navy apparently does not know how to use a radar, their soldiers are terrified to fight somebody capable of resistance, they failed to impress not only China, but even the North Koreans who are openly laughing at them. Hezbollah laughs at them. Even Venezuela refuses to be scared! The Iranians openly threaten them with consequences if they back out of the deal they signed. Even Pakistan is openly expressing its disgust with the USA. Ditto for Turkey. Heck – the Americans are losing on all fronts and the very best they can do is try to feel good about illegally harassing our diplomatic personnel! Pathetic, lame, losers!”
A “spokesperson” for the White House declared that Trump personally ordered the latest thuggery. Okay, that means one of two thing: either Trump is so weak that he cannot even fire a lying spokesperson or that he has now fallen so low as to order the “thug life” behavior of the State Department. Either way, it is a disgrace.
SEPTEMBER 4, 2017
What the Media isn’t Telling You About North Korea’s Missile Tests
by MIKE WHITNEY
“While China does maintain certain influence and while China sees North Korea as a buffer between it and the US-allied South Korea, Beijing’s ability to influence the erratic Kim Jong Un seems to be extremely limited, if at all, a significant change from earlier Kim dynasty dictators. The one power to gain from Kim Jong Un’s bellicose actions is the United States as geopolitical hegemon desiring to turn Japan and especially South Korea against China […]
“under the erratic 32-year-old Swiss-educated Kim Jong Un, Washington has found the perfect boogie man to scare South Korea and Japan into embracing Washington’s agenda to maximize pressure, military as well as economic, against Russia and against China […] Washington only had to cultivate the infantile personality of Kim Jong Un.”
North Korea is an Pentagon Vassal State
F. William Engdahl
Infantile, erratic? I would like to ask Mr. Engdahl what he would do as the leader of NK, with the most powerful military force on Earth on your doorstep and threatening to annihilate your tiny nation – for the second time? I think Kim Jong In is crazy like a fox. He is standing up to Uncle Sam. Crazy? I think he has a lot of guts. He is letting the bully know that he is going to fight with all he’s got if attacked. And he has made sure he can back that up.
I recommend that you actually read Engdahl’s article, mike k.
If the most powerful military force on Earth were on your doorstep and threatening to annihilate your tiny nation – for the second time – a crazy like a fox move would be to prop up the wannabe Asian hegemon’s geopolitical agenda. I’m not suggesting that’s Jin San Pang’s game. But Engdahl’s thesis merits consideration.
Abe, I haven’t yet read your link but this really says it all to me:
*Washington has found the perfect boogie man to scare South Korea and Japan into embracing Washington’s agenda to maximize pressure, military as well as economic, against Russia and against China …” The Thad missiles in SK and Japan’s government willing to milititarize (against the people’s will in both countries) show the US’s directing its allies, and I fear not to their good.
Another good link on the Kim regime and family https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Asia-Pacific/2017/0828/How-Kim-rules-What-the-North-Korean-leader-s-unexpected-directions-for-his-country-mean-for-the-US
Interesting read Virginia. I see Kim Jung un as being the poster boy for targeted anti-American blowback. In other words America ‘reaps what one sows’, or as Rev Wright once said, ‘the chickens are coming home to roost’. For every action there is a reaction, and you and I Virginia are witnessing it unfold, as we go about our daily life’s. The only ones who benefit from all these wars, is the very profitable Military Industrial (Congressional) Complex, and no others. Peace. Joe
I finally read the counterpunch article that Abe recommended. I think you’ll find it interesting, too, Joe. Here’s a paragraph from it:
“The North has no plan to nuke the west coast of the United States. That’s ridiculous! That doesn’t accomplish anything. What they want is to preserve their regime, procure security guarantees from Washington, lift the embargo, normalize relations with the South, extricate the US from the political affairs of the peninsula, and (hopefully) end the irritating and endlessly provocative 64 year US occupation. Yankee go home. Please.”
Yeah that Abe is something, and always quick with the right on references. I read that Mike Whitney article, and agreed with Whitney. In fact Virginia, the next paragraph after the quoted one you provided is essential to the story as well.
“Bottom line: The North is ready to deal. They want negotiations. They want to end the war. They want to put this whole nightmare behind them and get on with their lives. But Washington won’t let them because Washington likes the status quo. Washington wants to be a permanent feature in South Korea so it can encircle Russia and China with lethal missile systems and expand its geopolitical grip bringing the world closer to nuclear Armageddon.”
I’m of the belief, that WWIII won’t start in Korea, but I’m not so sure the spark which ignites the flames of war won’t be found inside of Iran. I seriously don’t trust the Israeli leadership, and their ambitions to be king of the hill in the Middle East. And if the spark is big enough, then I would suspect that this war will go global in an instant. Russia will roll into Ukraine, and be on the steps of Kiev within a week. China will no doubt take out a couple U.S. aircraft carriers, and then it will definitely be game on.
Although the possibility of no war is likely, if the U.S. tucks it in, and turns towards a true diplomatic solution. Then after that the most dangerous part will be to if the U.S. will honor such and or any treaty to the contrary of no war. Picture John McCain and Lindsey Graham trying to gulp a peaceful solution down.
The U.S. continues to act like it is 1953 when it comes to N Korea. It is long over due that the U.S. realize that all these nations that the U.S. attempts to contain inside of it’s realm, are all grown up now, and therefore the U.S. must realize that it has to change it’s foreign policy, to a policy of detente against using brute military force, and to quit threatening every nation who doesn’t dance to the U.S. tune….everything isn’t a nail.
Peace Virginia. Joe
The US can announce a trillion dollar upgrade to it´s nuclear arsenal, invade , occupy and bomb back to the stone age ( currently bombing seven different countries) country after country and not a peep out of the International Community, or the UN. North Korea developing nuclear weapons as a defence against a US Military attack is jumped upon with universal condemnation. Oh and I am 76 and ever since the Korean War where the US was fought and beaten to a standstill, every single US President had said that the US would nuke North Korea. The UN should be standing squarly behind North Korea considering the real and present danger it is in from a US attack.
If North Korea were to give up it´s nuclear capabilites tomorrow, you can be damned sure that it would be invaded and bombed back to the stone age within a couple of years. North Korea is neither suicidal or stupid, It´s leadership knows full well that it would be committing national suicide to give up it´s deterrent in the face of continued US aggression against it. For the life of me I do not understand the Chinese and Russians joining in this gang up on North Korea considering the adversary the North Koreans are facing in the USA.
I am 86 and was drafted to fight in the Korean War. I did not go. I refused. Even then, I had that much sense. Later a close friend who lived at my house was a Korean who privately taught me judo and calligraphy.
The Chinese and Russians are not joining in a gangup on USA, in defense of NK, because, unlike our W.S. Oligarchy and their minions in Gov’t and the Shadow Gov’t, and most of the American citizens, THEY realize that the ultimate strategic goal by the Western, Old World Oligarchs, is the destruction and subjugation of USA, Russia, and China into failed-state, wasteland colonial provinces of a new, global “Roman Empire”. Their instrument to achieve this scheme is steering the dead-from-the-neck-up USA into doing the dirty deed, destroying ourselves in the process. THEY realize that USA must be won over to THEIR side, via OBOR, to amass sufficient power to permanently check-mate these bastards; holdovers from the era of Euro-Empires (and our Wall Street wannabes). This was The Plan in the planning stages of WWII: USA/USSR/ROC vs. British, French, Spanish, Portugese, Dutch, Belgian, German, Italian, Japanese Empires. But Hitler didn’t follow the playbook, striking West first,instead of East to destroy himself in the process of destroying USSR , causing UK to enlist USA on the Allied side, despite STRONG proclivities to stay out of the conflict against the now-shrunken Axis Powers. But FDR had intel gathered in 1940, by French and American intel agents in the field, outlining the progenitors of the Fascist/NAZI Movement: Synarchy Internationale, already in existence for nearly a hundred years at that point…they still exist and are “in business”. Call them the BoardRoom NAZIs. My sources are from EIR and Tarpley.net.
Read between the lines : “China will do the right thing”.
Kind of unfortunate that NEITHER Iraq or Libya(for fairly obvious reasons) had signed or ratified the Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court( much like North Korea) making any claims of “war crimes” pretty much null and void!
Terry, yours is the funniest comment overall.
Remember- the purpose and objective of endless war is not winning, it’s surviving.
Washington attacked all those countries in the Middle East because it wanted to control, if not own, the oil beneath them and to construct pipelines for the delivery of oil and natural gas from our “allies” in the Persian Gulf states to our “allies” in Europe. Moreover, decimating all those countries was meant to give our overlords in Israel free reign over the entire region. The pretense that any of those countries realistically posed any threat to the United States, or even to our European vassals or Israel, was transparently bogus. Left to their own devices, even the most well-equipped military in the Middle East, i.e., Saudi Arabia, cannot subdue what is probably the poorest third world country on the planet, i.e., Yemen. Only Israel is an existential threat to its neighbors.
In contrast, what is it that Washington wants in North Korea? The land? The resources? To “liberate” the people? To secure the safety of South Korea? If so, it’s been playing a slow con for about 65 years. Surely, in that interim it could have either secured a peace treaty with the North or decided the issue in an actual shooting war long before nukes became an issue. The only thing Uncle Sam wants from North Korea is to be able to use it as a pretense for keeping its missiles locked onto Beijing and China’s military defenses. This is the same reason that Washington felt compelled to stick its snout into Ukraine, with Russia as the target. Washington doesn’t really want a scorched earth war in Korea, because the real plan falls apart if that happens. Moreover, China would surely move into the battle theater and drive the Yanks into the sea, unless Washington would be so foolish as to nuke China. China would then actually do what North Korea only blusters about, actually hitting the U.S. mainland with nukes. Nothing but bad moves left on the board for America.
You see how contrived this all is? And how badly it can all go wrong if Washington continues to play its foreign policy like some Sylvester Stallone or Arnold Schwarzenegger movie?
What does anyone with a brain think would happen if Washington, and it media lackeys, simply took a year-long hiatus on all things Korean and did nothing? Answer: absolutely nothing. There would be no invasion of South Korea, no missile attacks on U.S. or any other territory, and probably even the cross rhetoric would stop being bandied about. But then Washington wouldn’t have an excuse for deploying batteries of THAAD missiles, pointing at China, all along the DMZ.
Here is an article which describes how little by little Russia is overtaking the American empire.
Just for the record, I am not promoting anything here, that doesn’t have a basis in the truth. This American quest for global hegemony isn’t necessarily an American value we Americans should be proud of. My idea of an America which wins hearts and minds, isn’t an America which kills civilians as collateral damage, and then abuses its military members with one deployment after another. We Americans have much more than bombs to offer, so why not make lifelong friendships with foreign nations, as instead of creating more terrorist for future blowback attacks?
Before I read your article, Joe, just let me guess the take-home message. While Russians, Chinese, Indians and other ascendant economies are getting ahead with most everyone (who can make a difference) pulling together for the common good, our American workers no longer see what’s in it for them after being stiffed by the “ownership class” for nearly three straight generations. While their societies become progressively more cohesive, ours becomes more fragmented with the intrusion of “identity politics” in the social arenas that matter most. Can any other country possibly have as many citizens broken up into factions and angry at one another as we have here? (Outside of the Shia/Sunni divide in the Middle East which we have vigorously fostered.) I see Western European countries internally fragmenting along genomic and confessional rifts now too. Now let me go see if I’ve guessed the substance of your article.
Oh, well, missed that one. They say diplomatic acuity by Russia rather than internal social rot in America makes the difference.
The article could be read from that point of view that you just mentioned. The truth of the matter, is the article gets you to seeing the turning away from a war hardened America to a New Silk Road. I say Silk Road because the China project OBOR is just that, and Russia is very involved in it. The U.S. like it or not is moving inside of a multipolar world. What gives the Mutli strength, is America’s pass actions are resulting in a slow boil up process towards a global blowback of sorts. Arrogance coupled with delivering death where ever you go will get you a bad reputation. Will the sovereign crowd win out? Probably not, but an adjustment could be some welcome relief…who knows? My goal is to see the Doomsday clock go to where it’s never been, like back to quarter after. I actually think I have a Safe Room downstairs, and what bothers me most about that, is why am I even thinking of such things as that? Oh well. Joe
Dear Realist, I will always be your fan. Your thinking is more evolved than anyone I have ever read online. You always put your finger right on the main point – would there be the current NK “nuclear” crisis if China was not overtaking US economically? In other words, if someone is better economically, try to weaken him militarily (Ukraine=NK).
Indeed, it may be finally dawning on our aristocracy that they have sold out the country for short term gains in the economic arena by offshoring all our jobs and transferring all our high technology to China to increase their personal profits. They can finally see that the industrious Chinese are in the process of blowing our doors off, locking down trade around the globe and soon to become the dominant economy in the world. Being genuine White Supremacists, unlike the economically disadvantaged rubes they recruit to fight our wars and march in the streets wearing bedsheets, the rise of any society outside of Western Europe or North America galls them no end. That they would lose their place in the global pecking order has them panicked and making dangerous decisions.
It is not US that they worry about, it is that their cherished Globalist World Order is at risk if the main tool of the hegemony is dying. Thus (the low-intensity) war on economic competition. And we believe them that they can keep it low-intensity without slip ups and f’ ups, just like they successfully kept the economic lead after WW2 and the fall of the Eastern Block? Riiiiight!
I don’t mean to imply that they CARE about US, the people. No, they care about the strength of the economy and the dollar which they themselves have sabotaged through their policies. They are not in the least being altruistic in their epiphany. It is based on sheer selfishness and greed. They thought all that was required for global hegemony were strong banks, high stock prices, a monopolistic lock on natural resources, rich oligarchs and the most powerful military on the planet. The people? They are only grist for the mill.
This is master chess played by “we will only do the right thing”
Correct analysis. For more details, google PNAC
We are living in a 1984 society. This is not a fanciful SF idea – this is the actual reality of life now in America and in the world. We are all now living in the post-truth delusional world created by our mad authoritarian Rulers. Our thoughts, beliefs, and actions are largely determined by the lies and unrealities we have been brainwashed to believe in and adhere to. Often our conditioning is so deep that we will give up our lives to defend those who are enslaving us. The very words we use to think with have been corrupted so as to control and misinform us. Our perceptions and interpretations of the world around us have been skewed and altered so that they do not correspond to what is really happening. Our ability to think and act outside the boxes that have been created to contain us has been reduced to almost zero.
Is there any way out of this dystopian nightmare we are trapped in? Only if we join with others to achieve the freedom that only awakening to our diminished condition, and struggling to live beyond it’s shackles. Seeking to deal with our personal and civilizational crisis by trying to change some details of our enslaving mental conditioning will be totally inadequate to deliver the real and lasting freedom that is the true answer to our situation. The awakening of our hearts and minds must be truly revolutionary, or it will fail to deliver us from this dismal situation we are drowning in.
A growing number of small groups dedicated to exposing the lies we are living by could develop the kind of clear thinking persons necessary to effect the inner revolution necessary to make a new world. As Einstein said, it is hard to see how pursuing the same old ideas that got us into this mess could serve to get us out of it. We still have the ability to initiate these little cells of hope – will we use this opportunity or let it slip away, as we have done with so many of our possibilities?
The process that the CN essayists, commenters, and readers are seeking to further is one of deconstructing lies in order to discover underlying truths. This process could and should be further pursued in small groups dedicated to this re-education project. Personal sharing, reading liberating texts together, discussing important current societal problems, etc. are some of the ways to organize such small gatherings. Given the pressing crisis we are all facing, such work would probably best evolve through weekly evening meetings, in each others homes, accompanied by pot luck’s if desired. Many who share on CN would be ideally qualified to initiate such groups.
Alas, sad to say, I greatly fear that your analysis is correct. What can the world do when you have an empathy-challenged U.S. president who will no doubt raise the ante in some kind of “chicken-poker” where the pot is won by the side with the least humanitarian feelings. But in poker you have real winners and losers. In this “game” of threatening mass destruction there is a distinct possibility that both sides will experience catastrophe, either by deliberate acts, miscalculation or system malfunction. Furthermore, if the U.S. were to “win” in North Korea, that would not end matters, as China and possibly other countries are not likely to stand idly by.
What can readers do? I suggest one thing is to write to Congress and head this lunacy off at the pass, by challenging the deep state, something Trump was elected to do, but conspicuously has not.
I have just come from reading the (Toronto) Globe and Mail edition of April 10, 2003, where the fall of Saddam was greeted with such overriding optimism. The whole edition was largely celebratory and opponents were castigated as know-nothings. Time has shown otherwise.
Maybe faced with catastrophe, enough people will waken up to what can go wrong and put a stop to the military force “solutions.”
Once again, thanks to Mr. Parry for fearlessly writing about what should be recognized in the mainstream media, but isn’t. Instead we generally get from them a truncated history of events to suit the perceived interests of the political powers that be. It is time for people to meditate on the old parable of the wind and the sun, where each challenged the other as to who had the power to get a man to remove his overcoat (think military weaponry in this case). The wind blew and blew, but the man just held on tighter. Then the sun provided warmth so that the man shed his outer garment very willingly. Has genuine diplomacy and reasonable deal-making with North Korea really been tried? Trump was supposed to be all about exactly that, but he seems to have become prisoner of the military-industrial complex that Eisenhower warned against.
Randal…I like your analogy…however, although there are plenty of people to provide the wind in this scenario, the sun seems to be having a prolonged eclipse!
Just for clarification: when I wrote “Alas, sad to say, I greatly fear that your analysis is correct,” I was referring to Robert Parry’s original article.
Saddam Hussein’s execution/ murder was as grisly as Gaddafi’s. The Shiite militia hangmen who taunted him and lynched him bungled the job and tore his head off.
America has broken every agreement it has entered into. NATO enlargement/ Iran nuclear deal/ ABM Treaty/ Intermediate Missile Treaty. It also broke the N. Korea nuclear deal of the 1990s. N. Korea agreed to dismantle its nuclear programme in exchange for fuel oil and 2 light water reactors. The incoming Bush regime just welshed on the deal with its Axis of Evil rhetoric. So N. Korea reactivated its nuclear programme. If the US had abided by its commitments, the current crisis would never have arisen.
Any new US administration feels free to discard any existing agreement. When the Iran nuclear deal was being negotiated, the neocons announced in advance the would refuse to honour the agreement as soon as Obama left office. Any agreement, any undertaking, any treaty the United Snakes enters into simply isn’t worth the paper it’s printed on.
Indeed, habitual liars soon run out of friends.
interesting article at link below:
Three Dangerous Delusions about Korea
By James George Jatras
September 4, 2017
From Telegraph/AFP, 09 Jan 2016:
“North Korea cites Muammar Gaddafi’s ‘destruction’ in nuclear test defence
Pyongyang says the fates of the late Libyan leader and Saddam Hussein show the need for a nuclear deterrent
North Korea has defended its latest nuclear test, saying the fate of Saddam Hussein in Iraq and Muammar Gaddafi in Libya showed what happened when countries forsake their nuclear weapon ambitions. …
The KCNA commentary said the current international situation resembled the “law of the jungle” where only the strongest survive.
“The Saddam Hussein regime in Iraq and the Gaddafi regime in Libya could not escape the fate of destruction after being deprived of their foundations for nuclear development and giving up nuclear programmes of their own accord,” it said.
Both had made the mistake, the commentary argued, of yielding to Western pressure led by a United States bent on regime change.
Asking North Korea to give up its nuclear weapons was as pointless as “wishing to see the sky fall”, it said …”
“Pyongyang says the fates of the late Libyan leader and Saddam Hussein show the need for a nuclear deterrent.”
Maybe Kim Jong Un has seen this video/interview with Said Allslam Gaddafi (Take out my 3 sets of dashes and you’ll have the link maybe: https:–//www.youtube.–com/watch?–v=8Q-dtzSspfc
I took out the dashes and followed the link. Very instructive interview. Thanks for this.
The evil empire that The US has become is due to moral degeneration in it’s leadership, which has spread into the population as a whole. If a rogue state is one which cannot be trusted to do anything but treachery and betrayal, then that describes the USA exactly. We are the moral degenerates of the nations on Earth. Torture and death are our trademarks. Tyranny is our objective. When we are destroyed it will be our just reward.
Mike Whitney has an article on Counterpunch today that tells the simple truth about North Korea, and makes a good supplement to Robert Parry’s excellent essay.
I second that, pesky things never mentioned. Great articles, here and Counterpunch.
Mike,…unfortunately the historical record presented here is well documented and leaves little solace for our future. It can be summed up in almost kinetic terms:
arrogance+greed+lies=paranoia=insane actions and reactions.
BobH – You present an excellent formula for the production of bad karma. Works every time! Maybe it’s a cosmic law…..?
Mike,…I was trying to work on good karma but reality keeps injecting nightmare scenarios… let’s hope it’s a mirage and not the perfect storm!
Wonderful editorial, Robert! Everything you wrote needed desperately to be said. My hope is that certain people in D.C. read it, and that it is read in important editorial rooms in Europe, as well. I suppose that hope is vain, but one can always dream
Excellent article, By Mr. Parry, and right on the mark, I believe the regime change criminals should be charged with war crimes.
[More info at link below]
Stephen after looking over your blog I will encourage others to read it. Good points you make with the suggestion we prosecute certain individuals for war crimes. In fact, the only thing the U.S. is accomplishing, is that by our U.S. actions the U.S. is uniting countries, who otherwise would have never banded together, for any reason. It’s long overdue, that the U.S. join the world, instead of it always trying to dominate it. Good blog Stephen. Joe
Joe Tedesky, thanks for your encouragement. I try like many others, here, at Consortium News, to post info not seen in corporate media.
Cheers Stephen J.
By the looks of it Stephen, you and your blog are doing a fine job of it, and God only knows how essential it is to the public learning the truth. Good going. Joe
Trouble is, who’s going to hold the US government accountable? The list of war crimes goes back decades, yet…How does one go about doing it? They would be bombed to oblivion. It’s depressing and yet I still look everyday and hope…
We must somehow recapture our own government, taking it back from Wall Street, K Street, the Intel community that was captured by W. S. operatives (the Boardroom nazis, as distinguished from the battlefield nazis whom FDR helped defeat. He didn’t survive to deal with his Boardroom nazis, and Truman was too stupid and “local” to see the threat) immediately after Roosevelt’s death, which proceeded to capture MSM, MIC, Universities and bribe politicians over the ensuing decades, eliminating (JFK, RFK, MLK, Malcolm X, hell even George Wallace from the other end of the populist spectrum) any significant threat to their plans. I think a dues-paying Citizens Union must be set up to retake our government to restore sanity to our policies foreign and domestic. OWS forgot to, ya’know, actually OCCUPY Wall Street.
The main action of a Citizens Union is to sponsor candidates, sworn to fund their Campaigns only from Citizens Union monies, and watchdog them while in office. Remember, politicians term of office are already limited: two years for Reps, six for Sens, four for Prez. If we get a good one we WANT him or her to stay on task for 20 or 30 years, denying the seat to bribed pols.
Such a Union would realistically require membership from 40 or 50 million citizens. At ten$ a month, that’s 4 or 5 hundred million$ a month for campaigning and watchdogging.
Stephen J, I, too, believe regime-change criminals should be prosecuted. The mantra for Kim Jung Un’s mantra should be, “Remember Gaddafi!” Thank you, Mr. Parry, for your astute article.
On the subject of charging criminals for crimes, I understand the FBI has closed the book on Hillary’s email “matter.” In fact, they say, there is not sufficient public interest to re-open that investigation. My question to all: Is “public interest” the test for whether criminals should be charged? Is showing “no intent” to commit a crime a defense against prosecution? If the answer is yes for either or both questions, boy! the bar for guilt has been lowered to zero ground level for any crime, I’d say.
A bit off topic, but most of US government officials are above the law. This seems to go for the domestic law enforcement officials also. Joe Arpaio, the list is long indeed.
What ever happened to ” Ignorance of the law is no excuse”?
The only war is no war! We need to have cooperate business of never ending wars!
How refreshing to get professional journalism that addresses the actions and policies of the U.S. government and the lies that it propagates. Thank you.
Absolutely spot-on – when will USA stop demanding global hegemony and domination? Perhaps they cannot afford it altho’ huge savings could be made on military expenditure. Thanks for a very astute and convincing article.
Thank God for investigative reporters like Robert Parry. Because of him and those like him, a little light is still shining through to those who will only look for it!
While containing some truths and some sketchy opinions, the logic of the article’s argument: certain events have caused another event that was ongoing before the invasions is frayed. For an events to be considered a cause scientifically, it has to occur prior to, or contemporaneously, with the predicted event.
A more cogent and historically correct hypothesis would be the Korean War has never ended, and in the meantime North Korea has developed a stronger deterrent. The referenced US led invasions may have been a contributory factor, but not a primary cause. North Korea’s nuclear and missile programs have been ongoing for decades. Trump’s learning curve is so steep, he has exacerbated this advanced development, into a crisis, where accident and/or miscalculation could lead to a catastrophe, for our allies and our interests. North Korea’s primary deterrent has always been twofold: 1) a non-nuclear capability of decimating South Korea; and 2) a Chinese buffer to the USA, on the Korean peninsula.
What I remember is that the escalation of the production of nuclear weapons in North Korea got underway right after the fall of the Soviet Union which was its main ally. No one to protect it from US aggression, so it protected itself by developing its nuclear program even further. US wars in the middles east based on nothing but lies is certainly going to cause N. Korea to become alarmed and further it’s production of a nuclear arsenal. I see no sketchy opinions expressed in this article, but I do see your argument as little more then another argument that says lets blame Trump for creating this crisis, and as always a superficial assessment of things.
I’ve pointed out on another site,(Common Dreams) the war with NK hasn’t officially ended. The US government has been at it since 1950! Officially the war’s ongoing. Now, Nikki Haley won’t even talk, gimme a break already. I don’t find that NK has been aggressive, just the opposite, the US along with Japan and South Korea has just ended a large scale military exercise on NK’s doorstep. They do this every year, who’s being aggressive? It’s not just Trump but the US military machine just itching to use all of that expensive weaponry on someone and NK is IT this time.
Ol’ Hippy, China (and Russia) will just watch it this time as China did during the previous US war on the peninsula? Does anyone in US with two ounces of brain matter believe that China and Russia are approving of US threats and regime change schemes on NK. Is this because China and Russia mistakenly tried to appease the US lawless, out-of-control beast by voting for a UN resolution sanctioning NK? From that moment on, there will be only divergence and all out war if US escalates.
PS. Is it not impressive that a small nation of 25M people could develop a hydrogen bomb and delivery rockets, all on its own (unlike the Jewish state which got it all from the “non-proliferating” US Jewery)? This just shows that the North Koreans are as impressive people as the South Koreans.
China only says he will do the right thing, no more comment. But what does he means by this, maybe that they helped NK ?
What then is “some truth” about Israelis’ illegal acquisition of nuclear weaponry?
The article is spot on: The US (ZUSA) has been regime-changing one country after another by, allegedly, pursuing some mysterious humanitarian goals. In fact, ZUSA has zero concern for human life. See Iraq, see Libya, see Syria. North Korea uses the only available means to protect her sovereignty from the empire of Fed Reserve.
Robert Golden, Your critique of the logic behind this article does not take into consideration, IMO, a recurring dynamic of our foreign policy. It seems to me that our foreign policy makers have (as far back as I’ve started to pay attention to it – maybe 40 years) a so-called “TELL”!
Over and over again they seem to hatch, behind the scenes, a narrative about an immediate threat from a chosen heretofore innocuous VILLAIN – suddenly leader WHATCHAMACALLIT is an extremely dangerous character who must be dealt with forcefully because WHATCHAMACALLIT presents an imminent threat. Day after day, the drum beat echoes in the MSM.
Once we’ve created the VILLAIN of the moment, we list a set of demands that the VILLAIN cannot possibly comply with, using every contrivance to squeeze that VILLAIN into a corner from which there is no way out. We set up conditions that threaten their sovereignty or their political viability as a means to drive the situation into “justification” for a “preventive” attack which we intended from the beginning.
We are so f…..g transparent, given that we repeat this process over and over with the latest VILLAIN of choice.
The people who live in that country and who will suffer the consequences are ignored. The people who live here in this country and their interests are also ignored, especially our men and women who serve in the military and who always pay a huge burden.
No one counts except the single BAD GUY who must be taken down at all costs, while our deciders ignore the inevitable “unintended consequences”…..
The true reasons we focus often have something to do with our coveting of that country’s natural resources or a route to the natural resources of another country.
For some reason, we were never willing to sit down and talk with North Korea which they’ve been wanting for a while.
We insist on our unexplained conditions – a meeting with 5 or 6 countries….
And of course, the MIC benefits.
Here you may read to how Cambodia is dealing with U.S. NGO’s, and why.
On top of the U.S. not having any credibility towards allowing N Korea to disarm peacefully, it is understandable considering the outcome for those who did take refuge in the U.S. offer. Gaddafi and Hussein brokered a deal with the U.S. and paid the ugly consequence for doing so. So what precedent did the U.S. establish for others like the now deposed Libyan and Iraqi leaders, who learned the hardest way possible to what treaty breakers the U.S. Government can be? Maybe a Native-American could have warned them, but when was the last time anyone can remember the microphones being passed to an Original Nativist of this continent ever having so much influence?
Trump by threatening S Korea with Trade Agreement penalties, is now playing into the hands of Kim Jung un. The American President’s Twitter warning S Korea of appeasing N Korea, is another slap in the face to this supposed ally. If the S Koreans wish to be on speaking terms with their Northern cousins, then so be it. At this moment it seems that more hurt is being brought down on Moon Jae in and his newly elected S Korean government. None of this makes any sense. Possibly, America should do a review of this Korean situation, and tell Raytheon to find another product line to make money on. How about ecologically based product, for instance.
Okay trolls, now do your thing, because I have said my peace. Joe
I did some searching on the net for clues as to what went down on the Korean Peninsula 70 years ago. What I found was not surprising. We all know the commie north invaded the unprepared newly formed Republic of Korea under Syngman Rhee in July 1950. Nearly overrun, the UN saved the RoK, nearly taking the northern half from the commies until the Chinese intervened leading to an armistice and perpetual state of war.
Prior to all this, the US demanded the USSR hand over half of the Korean Peninsula as part of their alliance’ spirit of some sharing the load b.s. The Russians agreed, the line was chosen at the 38th parallel. Koreans had a grassroots community leadership known as the People’s Committees. In the North the USSR honored them as the legitimate government, in the South the US Army Military Government in Korea did not. The USSR left the People’s Committees to form the DPRK under Kim Il-sung, a man recognized to have fought the Japanese.
In the South, there was resistance to the joint government of US and Rhee, who spent most of his life in the US, and did not fight the Japanese. Following elections in mid 1948, the RoK headed by Rhee began rounding up communist sympathizers, and eliminating communist opposition figures. There was strong sympathies towards communism in the south because it was communists who freed the peninsula from Japan. These provocations led to the DPRK invading in June of 1950. Several hundred thousand peasants who had been rounded up as communist sympathizers dubbed the “Bodo League,” had been undergoing reeducation, but were all massacred at the start of the war.
It would have gone a-lot better for the Koreans if the USSR had figured the US for backstabbers and refused to allow the US a foothold on the Korean Peninsula.
More folks should take the time, as you Common Tater, and do the research as you did. Although it seems as though, more people find comfort in believing the unbelievable, rather than taking any time out of their busy life’s to seek out the truth. I’m as patriotic as anyone you will ever know, but I have made it a point to not get to head over heels with ‘blind patriotism’, for there is the Joseph Goebbels effect to avoid at any cost. I say this, because growing up in America I never heard of these terrible stories, that we are now hearing about, of how America bombed N Korea back into the Stone Age.
“Evidence of LeMay’s thinking is that, in his 1965 autobiography (co-written with MacKinlay Kantor) LeMay is quoted as saying his response to North Vietnam would be to demand that “they’ve got to draw in their horns and stop their aggression, or we’re going to bomb them back into the Stone Age.”
Although LeMay was referring to Vietnam, the Stone Age threat has been with us for quite sometime now. To be real, it doesn’t matter whether the Stone Age phrase was meant to describe the destruction of any one country, because regardless of who this phase was intended for death is still death.
Here is something to read, where the author speaks to how the UN has been of no help to the N Koreans, and in fact how the UN aided in the implementation of N Korea’s destruction.
Joe, I’ve been watching the UN in wonderment. It seems to be an arm of the US government of late, saying nothing of our illegal actions here (embassy seizures) and abroad. And you’re right, that people do not want to look at the truth, prefer darkness to light. Several times in dinner conversations this one “friend” says after I’ve volunteered something, “Does anyone have anything “good” to to talk about?” I’m certainly getting the message! Will it keep me from giving the warning? No, never!
You got your history wrong. Read http://www.amazon.com/Hidden-History-Korean-1950-1951-Nonconformist/dp/0316817708/
As always, the totalitarian American regime was responsible for the blood bath and pinned the blame on North Korea.
Don’t even deny it.
There is no doubt that the order to massacre the Bodo League “students” came from the American overseers. The “invasion” of the south by the DPRK now seems like an attempt to Liberate their fellow compatriots from the evil which replaced the Japanese occupation.
No one ever mentions that the ONLY country to use atomic weapons was the US. I recently read a book which is based on some newly released documents. It is clear that the Truman dropped two bombs, an atomic bomb and a hydrogen bomb on civilians in cities. he wanted to test them out and scare Stalin. The war was over, Japan was desperately trying to surrender. So when the media talk about Kim being crazy etc, it is a ridiculous claim. I don’t know what is going to happen but it is very sad and frightening.
So , in other words, the communism is so bad, that justifies dropping nuke on them?Who are you to tell them, what kind of system is good for them?If you like your system, enjoy it, but don’t force them to accept it.Slavery was “so good”, you even had a war to keep it, only slaves didn’t agree with it!Next thing you will bomb nations that practiczes other religion than you (ups, you allready did it years ago).Talking about indoctrination and propaganda, you are so full of it, you can’t see over it!
The counter argument is the difference in economic development between the North and South. I don’t really know enough to say why that is, but this evidence is stated as proof that ‘our way is better than their way’.
Conventional (Western) history of the post-war Korean peninsula starts with North Korea invading a (unsaid, but presumed to be) peaceful South. I have not been able to find much information easily but there was a lot of unrest in the South, with multiple massacres and over 100,000 people killed by the Rhee regime, including leftist opposition types, with (at a minimum) US passive support and possibly more profound support. The US was also supporting the claim that the South was the legitimate government of the entire peninsula and was working through the UN (then handcuffed, because the Soviets were boycotting and China was shut out in favor of the Chiang regime remnants on Taiwan) to have elections only in the South. So I’m not sure the invasion was not in reaction to the brutality and backstabbing going in the South. Similar things may have been happening in the North, but I have not seen any accounts of it. Comments?
Hello Joe, I am in the middle of my busy thing, yet I read Mr Parry’s article and your comment with interest.
But, I want to pick up on something related (remotely) to the US international behavior. It is about the faith of the nurse Alex Wubbels. I read many hundreds of US comments about the affair, but not even one mentioned the crux of the matter. And the crux of the matter is that the police officer Jeff Payne who violently arrested her did it despite the full awareness that he and the other police officers on the scene had the police body-cams rolling, in essence that his breaking of the law would be available for everyone to see. Another police scumbag in the video can even be heard saying that the “nurse’s hospital rules” were interfering with “our” (implying police owned) laws. This is for me the best illustration of what US truly is – a hierarchy of lawless scumbags. Therefore, this slimy little worthless police worm in human clothing at the bottom of the packing order wanted to break the law with impunity, just like Bush, Obama, the Clintons and now President Swamp. Impunity (immunity to law) is close to godliness in the sick system. Therefore, the little scumbag wanted to feel what the US presidential scumbags feel – that they can kill a few million or a few tens of millions, excrete megatons of bull (when will the World see a better US master of BS than Obama) and retire comfortably as deserving individuals.
It appears that millions of people of Seoul will be the first to pay with their lives for the war crime impunity of the US hierarchy of scumbags. Since the US hierarchy of scumbags dropped two nuclear bombs on the civilians of Japan, is it not be appropriate that they continue the annihilation of humanity just nearby the former ground zero of their huge crime.
PS The only thing worse than the nuclear annihilation is the unceasing flatulence coming out of the mouths of the President Swamp, Nikki Haley, the assorted generalissimo trash and the rest of this band of US scumbag goyim prostitutes. It appears that only the global nuclear war can bring a needed relief.
You’re so right. Scumbag is probably too nice of a word but at least it’ll pass the moderation algorithms now out of control on this sight, It;s almost impossible to list examples of people who fell they are about=ve the law anymore as those in blue, or undercover feel ok in treading on the Bill of Rights and peoples rights in general. Are they all transplants from the illegal wars the US has perpetuated ans feel the laws have been so trampled what’s one more case?
I have yet to hear how Mr pussy grab will exit the 30,000+ US soldiers in South Korea before the fire and flame, but maybe that is just more collateral damage, or some other deranged synapse firing in his demented brain. He would probably blame the North anyway. Something must be said about the multitudes of US soldiers stationed there in the South before he tweets more nonsense from his 12 yr old brain.
Yeah, I read that Japan is evacuating its 60,000 nationals from SK, but nowhere any mention of the 30,000 uniformed US hostages in SK. But, just as you said, their deaths would probably be a small price to pay to start nuking NK, China and Russia. All in self-defense, as usual.
Totally on the side, has anyone noticed how the US trolls everywhere are allowed to make fun of Kim Jong-un’s bodily corpulence? Try write something similar about Rosie O’Donnell and find the FBI knocking on your door.
Good point. Another indication of the superficiality of the US. “culture.”
You know Kiza, how in the pass we often would say, that we in the U.S. are ‘turning’ into a police state, well fellow world citizens let me tell you all right now…We have been ‘Turned’.
It’s official the USA is now a police state. When you see so much pardon going on, it’s just makes you have to stop and ponder too how deep, or like how top down does it all go. Petraeus gets a slap on the hand while Jeff Sterling gets jail time, why so easy for some, but impossible for others. Shouldn’t the citizens want the ‘whistleblower’ to get the slap on the wrest, since the whistleblower alerted the tax payer citizen of government wrongdoing? Now I see headlines where the FBI says due to lack of interest the FBI will quit investigating Hillary …if this true it wouldn’t surprise. The pardoning of Sheriff Joe sent a strong message, make no mistake about it. Trump, Sessions, and the MIC, will go full military grade cop on America’s ass, starting as of yesterday.
I hear ya, on Nikki. Isn’t she sweet? In regard to N Korea being the starting point to the beginning of WWIII, I will just say, why not? I mean if you need a ground zero to light the quick burn fuse to many global engagements, followed no doubt with a nuclear explosion, here and there, well yes you need a starting point. Like when Franz Ferdinand gets assassinated, or a Pearl Harbor…a New Pearl Harbor. I’m sure The Shadow G Crowd aren’t even hesitant the least bit to reuse that chilling PNAC phraseology…man that’s cold.
If someone is not careful all this saber rattling could set the spark. If we are to assess this coming war, then we should use a spread sheet mentality. Preemptive I’m sure looks pretty good. I hear people bring up the word when speaking about N Korea where they say ‘Preventative War’. You know what Otto von Bismarck had to say referencing Preventative War….”Preventive war is like committing suicide for fear of death”. I know I quote that Bismarck line a lot, but I like it, and it fits.
I actually have hope, because remember most of what we know comes delivered by our corporate news hounds, and you know them.
Good to hear from you Kiza. Joe
Thank you Joe for your thoughtful comment, as usual.
The article is spot on and says what needs to be said. This is the reality of the situation. The comments up to here meet that high factual realistic standard including the police state discussions and the nature of the yankee state and its rulers down to the local police goons.
Hey ‘exiled’ nice to hear from you. This police state I’m referring too, as you know, was created out of fear, and hate. No one really likes it, but many feel it necessary to go total cop, because we know the bad guys are out to get us.
Natural born Americans feel their jobs have been hijacked by the undocumented migrant, and yet never a word is spoken of the employer who hires these NAFTA refugees. Airports stay in lock down mode to prevent the Radical Islamist (not my word) from killing innocent Americans, but absent from any thought process, is the analogy of why these Muslim’s hate us so much. No American considers the attackers are a result of blowback for America’s longtime involvement in the Middle East attempting to spread freedom and democracy. If you float the idea that these terrorist are paid by an insider, like Saudi Arabia, then you are considered a conspiracy theorist. Yeah, go ahead and laugh at grandpa, but the real enemy is already inside the gate.
No to get to this level of a police state, Americans had to accept many, many, multiples of lies. The U.S. in fact although not doing well on the many battlefield fronts it forced itself upon, is doing remarkably well on the home front putting up the police barricades, as security reaches unprecedented new highs on the American home front. Each response to the next crisis takes us ever further down the road to an Orwellian world of 1984.
The good news, is if we Americans can somehow manage to struggle through this police state phase, the more we Americans will learn collectively how to make a better world once this police state is crushed, and is no more. You might say, the U.S. Citizen needs to learn from their mistakes, of not staying on top of things. To gain freedom is one thing, to keep it, is a whole nother thing.
Take care exiled. Joe
This troll says that your comment may be one of your best, most thoughtful ever, Joe Tedesky!!!!!
Thank you for the compliment evelync. Although you could never make a good troll, because you are too genuine and real with your comments, and I have probably read almost all of your comments to know enough of what I am talking about in regard to you. Just for the record, I’m starting to look forward to the trolls, because they give me practice to refine my geopolitical philosophy, and how to defend my positions. Yet, it is always good to comment against those who whether we agree with them or not isn’t the point, as much as the comments remain somewhat civil. I just like civil. I also wish we Americans would quit with the childish name calling and the use of terrible taunts, as a way of expressing ourselves with each other. We Americans need to unite more, that’s all. Thanks again evelync. Joe
Hey Joe, Kiza, Exiled, Evelyn, Everyone, …Did you pick up on how Putin exonerated Trump when someone at BRICS asked him what he thought of Trump — that he hasn’t followed through on friendship? Putin responded that he was not surprised, that it was expected; that Trump should do whatever is in the interest of his country just as he, Putin, acts in the interest of Russia. What an answer! If anyone is listening (Dems and Mueller, for example), Putin was talking to them, as well as to all those duped by MSM. No collusion! No Manchurian puppet! But, as per usual, a show of respect from a well mannered diplomat.
Sounds like there is a military coup in the cards for Moon Jae in and his newly elected S Korean government …
Hey Higgs you may have hit the nail on the head. Yes, it would not be beyond our CIA or the Mossad to do something so dastardly, as to orchestra a coup to oust Moon Jae in from office. From what I have learned so far about Moon Jae in, he sounds like the type of leader who could forge a peace with N Korea. So once again Higgs, your sighting a government coup in S Korea may have some lift for such a flight, as a coup to get airborne. Let’s hope we are both overreacting and somebody in Washington comes about to do the right thing. Stop threatening Kim Jung un with military exercises, and for once and for all sit down and hammer out a peaceful agreement in the Korean peninsula. Higgs you take care now. Joe